Forum archive - ImgBurn can't find a place for a layer break

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ImgBurn can't find a place for a layer break

PhoneMatt posted 2009 Oct 24 10:55

I have a large flash video, which I have re-encoded, with DVD Flick. The file is about 7.3 G. I want to burn it onto a DVD+R DL. (Yes, it is a Verbatim disc.) The files have re-encoded and DVD Flick has authored the DVD, but it won't burn. ImgBurn gives an error message that it can't find a place for a layer break. It tells me where the break should be and mentions something about splitting the cell. For me, this is uncharted territory. What has happened and how can I correct it? I realize that I could run it through DVD Shrink to get it smaller, but I'm afraid that the quality will really be bad, after that. Matt

ron spencer posted 2009 Oct 24 11:42

you need to get it smaller...and add a chapter or two in the middle of the movie (this will provide a cell to put the layer break on). Never fill a dual layer disk near capacity. I make it never past 90% of full size, this way lots of extra space to pad for a break. Try DVDShrink on it....should be ok at 90% size.

MOVIEGEEK posted 2009 Oct 24 12:26

Use PGCEdit to split a cell. The flash video quality is probably not great to begin with so reducing it to 4.7GB won't matter.

skaleton posted 2009 Oct 24 13:24

I had similar problem. I used this advicefrom 2006. VegasBud : Assuming you're using the latest PgcEdit, when it puts up the error message saying it can't find a suitable cell, look in the section that starts with "Note for expert users:". It will suggest which cell to split. Just open the your dvd folder in VobBlanker, go to the cell PgcEdit suggested, and click the "Split" button. A new window pops up where you can scroll the cell contents to where you want to split it. Click the "Mark" button to set the split point, and click the "OK" button. Close anything needed to get back to the main VobBlanker screen. Select the directory where you want the new version of the dvd to go, and click the "Process" button. When VobBlanker is done, open the new version of the dvd in PgcEdit, and try to set the layer break point again (in PgcEdit). It worked despite the size being 99% and not having added any extra chapter, which I have cannot figure out how to do in pgcedit. Also in pgcedit, I could not find the function to split a cell.

skaleton posted 2009 Oct 24 21:21

Following Ron Spencer's advice, I went back to the original files and stripped the languages I did not need (or could not understand ;)) with VobBlanker to a size down to 93% and now, without doing anything else, ImgBurn finds a cell where it can make a layer break. So thank you.

ron spencer posted 2009 Oct 24 21:56

hey...size matters!!!! :-)

skaleton posted 2009 Oct 25 14:56

Interesting to compare (although it is quite obscure to me :?: ) the ImgBurn log for the 2 solutions Splitting cell. Difference between image size and file size = 641,024 B : Size: 8,487,581,696 bytes Sectors: 4,144,327 Image Size: 8,488,222,720 bytes Image Sectors: 4,144,640 Reducing the size. Difference between image size and file size = 514,674,688 B : Size: 7,951,593,472 bytes Sectors: 3,882,614 Image Size: 8,466,268,160 bytes Image Sectors: 4,133,920 Does it mean that ImgBurn requires a certain space to work out and implement the layer break into the image and if there is not enough space, you get the error message "Unable to find any cells that could be used for the layer break!" unless you create the layer break before hand?

Dimmer posted 2009 Oct 26 03:11

skaleton : Does it mean that ImgBurn requires a certain space to work out and implement the layer break into the image and if there is not enough space, you get the error message "Unable to find any cells that could be used for the layer break!" unless you create the layer break before hand? No, that's not it. Second layer (Layer 1) on DVD cannot be larger than first layer (Layer 0). Potentially user may select layer break so that more data is allocated to Layer 1 than to Layer 0. In this case ImgBurn automatically adds padding (i.e. leaves some unused space) at the beginning of Layer 0 so that both layers end up having the same size. Size of the required padding is indicated on the layer break selection dialog. As a result, image size may be much larger than combined size of all the files. Of course, it cannot exceed size of the disc. ron spencer : Try DVDShrink on it....should be ok at 90% size. I wouldn't decrease video quality by compressing since you have enough space on the media. The error "Can't find a place for a layer break" confirms that there is in fact enough space. There are few different ways of finding a place for layer break: 1) Open DVD in PgcEdit. If the DVD contains more than one titleset (VTS), try re-ordering them in all possible combinations, each time reloading the VIDEO_TS folder in ImgBurn. A suitable place may become available for layer break. This will take only a couple minutes. 2) Strip any unnecessary audio streams and other material. This may work due to decreased DVD size. 3) If it still doesn't work, follow the old advice already quoted. Open DVD in VobBlanker and split it without creating new program/chapter in the location indicated on the ImgBurn error message. This is guaranteed to work. And no, PgcEdit itself doesn't split cells.

PhoneMatt posted 2009 Oct 26 08:53

Thanks for all of the advice. I tried DVD Shrink first, shrinking it by 10%. I was pretty sure that I had enough room on the disk, but Shrink is a program I know and feel comfortable working with. It still would not burn. It only has an English audio track, so there is nothing extra to remove. I opened it in pgcEdit and tried to burn. It said that the break should be in block 137, between 1850976 and 2086912. (Interestingly enough, the exact same range that ImgBurn gave.) I opened VobBlanker. It shows the file as having only 1 cell- a very large cell. I tried splitting it around the middle of the video, but must have done something wrong, because after processing, I had an exact duplicate of the file. (I know, RTFM.) I'll work more with VobBlanker and let you know what happens. Just a quick question- Would it have been easier to split the original Flash into 2 videos, and have DVD Flick author the DVD with both pieces? Is it possible to split a Flash video or do you wind up with synch problems?

handyguy posted 2009 Oct 26 10:41

You can generate a *.dvd file & this lets it know where it's LB should be. You select that .dvd file with ImgBurn & it does the rest.

skaleton posted 2009 Oct 26 10:54

Thanks Dimmer for the comment on the layers and how ImgBurn works. Too bad I already removed the original files, as I would have tried your method 1 (since as mentioned, I successfully applied methods 2 & 3), although it seems a bit tricky. Apparently you need to remap them first. It is not very clear in PgcEdit manual. PhoneMatt, I am not an expert but, my size after stripping was 7.4 GB, I would think that your problem is not there. I am surprised that DvdFlick would create a Dvd DL without a break. In the properties of the title, did you create some chapter? Then if I remember correctly, dvdflick creates a cell per chapter.

Dimmer posted 2009 Oct 26 19:51

skaleton : Thanks Dimmer for the comment on the layers and how ImgBurn works. Too bad I already removed the original files, as I would have tried your method 1 (since as mentioned, I successfully applied methods 2 & 3), although it seems a bit tricky. Apparently you need to remap them first. It is not very clear in PgcEdit manual. Right, the function I was referring to is called Remap Titlesets in PgcEdit. There is nothing tricky to it. When you move titlesets up and down on that dialog, you essentially re-arrange the order in which files will be recorded on the disc. Resulting DVD will play the same regardless of the titleset order. PhoneMatt : I opened it in pgcEdit and tried to burn. It said that the break should be in block 137, between 1850976 and 2086912. (Interestingly enough, the exact same range that ImgBurn gave.) I opened VobBlanker. It shows the file as having only 1 cell- a very large cell. I tried splitting it around the middle of the video, but must have done something wrong, because after processing, I had an exact duplicate of the file. (I know, RTFM.) I'll work more with VobBlanker and let you know what happens. Just a quick question- Would it have been easier to split the original Flash into 2 videos, and have DVD Flick author the DVD with both pieces? Your original problem is caused by the fact that you didn't create any chapters in your DVD project. You can get away with this when using single-layer DVD-R but not DL because layer break must be set to beginning of a cell. Therefore you need to have at least two cells on a DL disc. Splitting the original video is only worth the trouble if you have two or more segments and want them to play as independent titles. In you future projects, create chapters every 5 or 10 minutes or whenever it seems like a good place for a chapter break, for example when picture fades to black. Meanwhile keep on with VobBlanker, you almost got it. When you open the split window, it shows current sector number under Sector (abs), which you'd want to be within the range indicated by ImgBurn/PgcEdit when setting the split point. One hint about using VobBlanker for you: if processing only takes a second, you're doing something wrong; splitting your DVD will require copying the whole 7GB, so it should take a while.

tinker posted 2009 Oct 26 21:56

PhoneMatt Check this guide. It describes in detail what to do in your situation. http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=6376

PhoneMatt posted 2009 Oct 27 07:20

OK, I think that I've got it. Dimmer, I didn't specify any chapters for the video. Big mistake. (To be honest, I've never used DVD Flick for a file this large. All of my other attempts have fit on a single layer disc.) I changed that and it is re-encoding now. Hopefully that will work. Now that I've tried VobBlanker, I'm going to keep playing with it. It's a very interesting program. Tinker, thanks for the pointer to the ImgBurn forum. That gives very complete instructions on this. Thankfully, they use lots of pictures, so that even I can follow it. I'm always amazed at the amount and quality of free software available to us. The authors really deserve our support.

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